11-02-2011 07:12 AM
madnj, did you manage to flash normally (not force-flashing) from SD25 to SD28, when you did it for the first time ? The same question, when you flashed from SD26 to SD28 ?
For me it went normally, without force flashing, when went from SD24 to SD28 and from SD26 to SD28.
11-02-2011 07:52 AM
I was able to normally flash my drive to every firmware from SD25 up to SD28, but have had to force flash back because you have to if you want to load a prior firmware.
I completely and totally disagree though that running a Linux test would not have the problems that Ironclaw found with SD25. SD25 firmware and the linux kernel in my opinion do NOT work well together, as evidenced by Ironclaw testing with multiple drives. MacOS also has the issue because it uses an underlying Linux based kernel.
I disagree with your assessment that SD26 based drives (ones that shipped with SD26) use the SSD portion, because the actual firmware filesize is so small in comparison to SD25 and SD28. I personally believe Seagate was trying to resolve the issues identified and released SD26 temporarily (and not publicly) to get drives out on the market without the issues that people were having with SD25 and previous versions.
I haven't seen a lot of reports of Windows users having problems with the SD25 firmware, but have seen a lot of issues mentioned with Linux and Mac systems. That again would point to the firmware issues being exploited by the Linux/Mac kernel rather than Windows. I'm not saying that no one on a Windows PC had issues with SD25, but I don't feel it's that widespread.
Of course there are multiple versions of the drive because there were likely multiple runs of manufacturing, but I don't think there were any real changes to the actual drive internals outside of maybe different branded flash chips or spindles.
Again, I'm not going to perform the Linux test because it's POINTLESS to do so! I expect the problem to exist, and I don't need to prove it does or doesn't because I'm running Windows where the problem has NEVER been reproduced!
Look, flash or don't flash, you seem to be looking for whatever excuse you can find to not try SD25. I am not going to convince you one way or another. Throw the drive in the trash if you want to. Take anecdotal evidence from anyone and everyone else and look for reasons to blame SD25 for my end to end errors or not.
It doesn't matter anymore. Regardless of my SMART status, my drive works BEST on SD25 and is majorly impacted with SD28. If you want to actually try to reproduce the problems I had with SD28, install Starcraft 2 and play singleplayer for a while. If you get audio stuttering, you're getting the same issue I was.
I'm done trying to convince you, and I never really was. I performed 80GB of data transfer and checksum validation against my drive to try to show that the corruption was not occuring under Windows. Take that however you want. Obviously you are too scared to give it a try, but don't try to act like you've actually done any testing on SD25 to say that it's good/bad or otherwise. At least I went through the paces on a Windows build to see that it's not a problem.
If I was to run Linux? First thing I'd do is run the Ironclaw test. I probably wouldn't run SD25, definitely wouldn't if I had a problem.
I've done what I can in Windows, and there are no issues I can see outside of having a drastically faster boot time and overall more responsive system than any other firmware. At least I went as far as to test it.
11-02-2011 08:13 AM - edited 11-02-2011 08:20 AM
Hey... you took it personally. I did tell you that I actually USE both Win and Linux. Yes, SD25 does scare the s*** out of me under Linux. Why wouldn't it ?
So yes, just to clear up this whole sharade, I'll go ahead and flash to SD25. And do the tests.
I was just hoping for you to do the same with Linux....
Well, I'll get back in a few hours (days........)
11-02-2011 08:42 AM
Hey, I understand, and no I don't take it personally. I just am speaking from a Windows perspective and based on my own experience.
I don't and won't use Linux on this system (if I did it would be via Windows VM) so I don't expect I'll ever have any chance to run into the issue reported with Linux/MacOS.
I understand the fear of SD25 since there have been some horror stories, but flashing to it and doing some quick performance testing (maybe rebooting 2-3 times) should tell pretty quickly if you have any issues. If you do, reflashing to SD28 isn't a difficult thing to do. For me, and others, SD25 performance is better and we don't have issues. Many people got SD25 preloaded on their drives and never updated. Most of those people did not have issues or there would be MUCH more noise about SD25 issues.
In any case, flashing and doing some testing in Windows should not cause you corruption issues because as mentioned those only occurred in Linux/MacOS based on all of the feedback we've gotten.
11-02-2011 01:42 PM
Running on SD25... doing the checksum tests under Win XP.... then Linux.... then speedtests....
When booting into Windows for the first time after the forceflash to SD25 I got a BSOD.... that is a first bad sign for me.
11-02-2011 02:04 PM
Very strange... No bluescreens for me... It's definitely odd that some drives seem to really like SD25, but others don't. All I know is that SD28 is just not usable for me due to the stutters and lag.
11-02-2011 03:51 PM - edited 11-03-2011 03:24 AM
FILE CORRUPTION after 10 x 4GB files in Windows XP SP3 32bit (after a first batch of 15 without issues).
Here's the output of my (2nd) 15 test file batch:
These are SHA-1 checksums. The MD5 checksums for the original and the 10th, corrupted file are:
I'll shortly check the differences between the two files...
I've also had my second Blue Screen and restart.
SD25 corrupts files in WINDOWS, LINUX and MAC OS. That's about it. Don't use it !
Going back to SD28.
11-02-2011 04:59 PM
Well, sorry it's not working for you, but there must be some difference between our drives because I don't get any corruption on my system as tested on 80GB of files that checksummed correctly. I'm still on SD25, as are several others from the Notebookreview forums without issue.
In any case, I'd love to see a firmware that works on all drives, but SD28 doesn't exactly work for me, and performance is horrid.
11-03-2011 03:14 AM - edited 11-03-2011 04:03 AM
The file corruption appeared only after copying about 25 x 4GB files under WINDOWS XP SP3 32bit.
I did a first test of 15 x 4GB and everything was OK. Then in the second batch of 15, the 10th file is damaged. There is a block of zeros in this file of about 512 kB where data has not been written !
This is unacceptable and I'm sure that a careful investigation will show corruption on any SD25 firmware. One needs to copy from a SATA, high speed connected drive a random-filled 4 GB file (as Ironclaw generated) to the MXT at least 30 times (maybe more). That is more than 100 GB of data and it takes some time.
My batch file for testing looks like this:
sha1sum.exe random_4000mb > d:\mxt_out\check_in.txt
copy random_4000mb d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.01
sha1sum.exe d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.01 >> d:\mxt_out\check_out.txt
copy random_4000mb d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.02
sha1sum.exe d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.02 >> d:\mxt_out\check_out.txt
copy random_4000mb d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.03
sha1sum.exe d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.03 >> d:\mxt_out\check_out.txt
copy random_4000mb d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.04
sha1sum.exe d:\mxt_out\random_4000mb.04 >> d:\mxt_out\check_out.txt
continuing up to 30 or more. The input (good) file is called random_4000mb and alongside the sha1sum.exe file reside on the non-MXT drive. D is the partition on the MXT to which I copied the data.
People, if you use SD25, take your time and test that drive thoroughly... let the tests run for 2-5 hours.
I got blue screens with SD25 twice just yesterday.
One more thing: SD25 is in NO WAY faster than SD28 for me. It is exactly the same speed. They both boot in 1m10s for me and behave very similarly in windows/movies/games.
It seems to me that the only reliable and fast enough firmware is SD28 at this point (for those without stuttering/lags).
SD28 stutters mostly for those people who already had End-to-End errors with SD25. Those drives need to be RMAd.
11-03-2011 01:00 PM
Because my drive was under warranty, I was able to return it to the place I bought it and get a replacement. The first thing I did after installing the drive was boot with the SD28 upgrade ISO and flash the latest firmware.
I am now currently installing Windows/updates/drivers, but I was able to bring up HDTune and check the S.M.A.R.T. data and see a single End to End error already.
The drive itself however appears to be performing well so far with SD28. I'll provide updates, but the fact that you were able to reproduce corruption with SD25 in Windows was worrying enough that I wanted to get off of it, and the fact that I have a few other issues with my S.M.A.R.T. data also made it a pretty easy decision when I found out that the vendor would take it back and swap it no questions asked.
In any case, I'm seeing pretty good performance so far with SD28 on this drive, and I'll let you know if my issues are fully resolved.